"Moreover, you scorned our people, and compared the Albanese to sheep, and according to your custom think of us with insults. Nor have you shown yourself to have any knowledge of my race. Our elders were Epirotes, where this Pirro came from, whose force could scarcely support the Romans. This Pirro, who Taranto and many other places of Italy held back with armies. I do not have to speak for the Epiroti. They are very much stronger men than your Tarantini, a species of wet men who are born only to fish. If you want to say that Albania is part of Macedonia I would concede that a lot more of our ancestors were nobles who went as far as India under Alexander the Great and defeated all those peoples with incredible difficulty. From those men come these who you called sheep. But the nature of things is not changed. Why do your men run away in the faces of sheep?"
Letter from Skanderbeg to the Prince of Taranto ▬ Skanderbeg, October 31 1460

Questions and Answers!!

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Questions and Answers!!

#1

Post by Arta » Wed Oct 28, 2009 6:25 am

Since we get a lot of questions from some greek wannabe historians, I thought I bring those questions here, and we can develop them, so if needed for next time, they are here to be found!

HectortheGreek has been buzzing me about these questions, any of you who are more familiar with history and this time, please help. Most of their questions are laughable, but anyway we got to educate some people.
Thank you in advance!


Why did the Albanians looked exactly like Greeks in 1332?
What does the term "entirely like them in their dress and manner" means according to you?
Why did the Albanians switched their "Greek" hat for the "Slavic" qeleshe or pils as you call it?
What happened to the "Latin" people that inhabited north Albania in 1332? Did they move to the moon at some point?
"I never gave anybody hell! I just told the truth and they thought it was hell."~Harry S. Truman

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Re: Questions and Answers!!

#2

Post by jay_albania_fan » Wed Oct 28, 2009 7:15 am

Arta wrote: 1. Why did the Albanians looked exactly like Greeks in 1332?
2. What does the term "entirely like them in their dress and manner" means according to you?
3. Why did the Albanians switched their "Greek" hat for the "Slavic" qeleshe or pils as you call it?
4. What happened to the "Latin" people that inhabited north Albania in 1332? Did they move to the moon at some point?
1. Albanians did not look like Greeks in 1332 just as they don't look like Greeks today. Albanians have kept the original Indo-European appearance because very few outsiders settled there as compared to Greece which was a meeting place of many people. Albania is far less accessible than Greece.

2. Everything is relative. Albanians are more like Greeks than say Greeks are like the Chinese or Albanian are like the Zulus.

3. The Albanians do not and never did wear Slavic hats. The Greek national/folk outfit of today is in fact mostly Albanian. The Greeks seemed to have abandoned much of their ancient styles by Byzantine times and then especially during the Ottoman period. I don't see the khitōn or khlamus much worn today.

4. Romans did not settle in northern Albania. Some Illyrians north of Albania were Romanized, but they were all Slavicized. The Albanians in Albania, Kosova, parts of Montenegro/Macedonia/northern Greece are those Illyrians who were not Romanized/Slaviziced/Hellenized. The mountains of Albania kept those people mostly out.
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Re: Questions and Answers!!

#3

Post by Arta » Wed Oct 28, 2009 7:42 pm

Thank you Jay!

Their claims and questions are so ridiculous, that it leaves you with a shock..lol Another thing I pointed to him out was that,-Just to take and look at Arberesh of Italy which have moved to that area time after time before even Ottoman invasions, and they still keeping the same traditions, language, costumes, and have almost the same appearance even in physical.
"I never gave anybody hell! I just told the truth and they thought it was hell."~Harry S. Truman

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Re: Questions and Answers!!

#4

Post by Arta » Thu Oct 29, 2009 6:17 pm

So here goes Hector as always with his rambling answers, maybe someone got a response for this!


Repetitio mater studiorum est as the old Latins would say. So let's repeat a previous comment. The text is from the "Itinerarium Symonis Semeonis", translated by Dr. R. Elsie, and describes the Albanians in 1322.

"For the Albanians themselves are schismatics, using the rites of the Greeks and are ENTIRELY LIKE THEM IN THEIR DRESS AND MANNER. For LIKE THE GREEKS, they rarely if ever wear the cowl, but rather A WHITE HAT LOWERED ALMOST FLAT TO THE FRONT AND RAISED AT THE BACK so that their hair, the length and beauty of which they are extremely proud, may appear more attractive to the eyes of the beholder. THE SLAVS on the other hand, of whom mention was made above, WEAR A WHITE HAT, OBLONG AND ROUND, on the top of which their nobles stick a long feather ...".

Now what does the previous text tells us? First, it says that the Albanians in 1322 were "ENTIRELY LIKE THE GREEKS IN DRESS AND MANNER". What dress did that traveler saw the Albanians wearing back then? It was the fustanella of course, the dress that the Albanians like to consider as their own invention. What does the term manners implies? It implies culture of course, music, dances etc, the ones the Albanians consider their own invention. And of course the Albanians at that time did not wear the Slavic qeleshe, they were wearing the Greek hat; they only recently started wearing the "Slavic" qeleshe. In those times, how someone was dressed was important as it stated his nationality. And the Albanian ancestors were stating, through the way they were dressed, their own nationality. They dressed like Greeks and had the manners of the Greeks.

So what you posted as responses to my questions was actually nonsense; all of them. When, for example, you post a comment saying that the Romans did not settle in northern Albania, you contradict all known history and this makes you look like the greatest of all fools. One of the most vital roads of the Roman Empire, the Via Egnatia, started in northern Albania. Another important road started from Scutari and ended in Salona, Dalmatia, passing through the Illyrian mountains, where according to the book of Illyrian fair tales your ancestors were hiding. The Romans colonized many places along those roads in order to protect them as military and trade roots. Please do yourself a favor; find and read the works of Arthur Evans and John Wilkes about ancient Illyria and Dalmatia.

Meletius was an educated Epirotan (born in Ioannina, Epirus) who became bishop of Athens in 1703. He was an intellectual who among others wrote and published a geography of the world in 1728. Describing Albania he refers to the old legend about the Albanian migration to the Balkans. Here is that text:

"Albania got its name from the Albani, which are neither of the Illyrian gens as some assume, nor of the Albanians that exist in Asia, but originate from a Celtic gens that migrated in Iapygia [ Apulia] of Italy and from there to Dyrrachion from where they dispersed around".

Is there an Albanian text that confirms what Meletius wrote in 1728? Yes there is; it is the "Cronicle of John Musachi". If you read the text of that chronicle carefully, you will find the same legend there. The time frame there is correct, also the place names and only the people's names are somewhat different from the actual ones. And another thing; if the Albanians are actually the descendants of the ancient Illyrians how come that John Musachi did not mention this in his chronicle? The answer is simple; John Musachi did not know anything about the alleged Illyrian ancestors; he did not consider Illyrians to be related with the modern Albanians. Only the books of Illyrian fairy tales says that. And another thing: the only error of Meletius is that he considered the Albanians to be of Celtic origin.
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Re: Questions and Answers!!

#5

Post by jay_albania_fan » Thu Oct 29, 2009 7:14 pm

Arta wrote:So here goes Hector as always with his rambling answers, maybe someone got a response for this!


Repetitio mater studiorum est as the old Latins would say. So let's repeat a previous comment. The text is from the "Itinerarium Symonis Semeonis", translated by Dr. R. Elsie, and describes the Albanians in 1322.

1. "For the Albanians themselves are schismatics, using the rites of the Greeks and are ENTIRELY LIKE THEM IN THEIR DRESS AND MANNER. For LIKE THE GREEKS, they rarely if ever wear the cowl, but rather A WHITE HAT LOWERED ALMOST FLAT TO THE FRONT AND RAISED AT THE BACK so that their hair, the length and beauty of which they are extremely proud, may appear more attractive to the eyes of the beholder. THE SLAVS on the other hand, of whom mention was made above, WEAR A WHITE HAT, OBLONG AND ROUND, on the top of which their nobles stick a long feather ...".

Now what does the previous text tells us? First, it says that the Albanians in 1322 were "ENTIRELY LIKE THE GREEKS IN DRESS AND MANNER". What dress did that traveler saw the Albanians wearing back then? It was the fustanella of course, the dress that the Albanians like to consider as their own invention. What does the term manners implies? It implies culture of course, music, dances etc, the ones the Albanians consider their own invention. And of course the Albanians at that time did not wear the Slavic qeleshe, they were wearing the Greek hat; they only recently started wearing the "Slavic" qeleshe. In those times, how someone was dressed was important as it stated his nationality. And the Albanian ancestors were stating, through the way they were dressed, their own nationality. They dressed like Greeks and had the manners of the Greeks.

2. So what you posted as responses to my questions was actually nonsense; all of them. When, for example, you post a comment saying that the Romans did not settle in northern Albania, you contradict all known history and this makes you look like the greatest of all fools. One of the most vital roads of the Roman Empire, the Via Egnatia, started in northern Albania. Another important road started from Scutari and ended in Salona, Dalmatia, passing through the Illyrian mountains, where according to the book of Illyrian fair tales your ancestors were hiding. The Romans colonized many places along those roads in order to protect them as military and trade roots. Please do yourself a favor; find and read the works of Arthur Evans and John Wilkes about ancient Illyria and Dalmatia.

3. Meletius was an educated Epirotan (born in Ioannina, Epirus) who became bishop of Athens in 1703. He was an intellectual who among others wrote and published a geography of the world in 1728. Describing Albania he refers to the old legend about the Albanian migration to the Balkans. Here is that text:

"Albania got its name from the Albani, which are neither of the Illyrian gens as some assume, nor of the Albanians that exist in Asia, but originate from a Celtic gens that migrated in Iapygia [ Apulia] of Italy and from there to Dyrrachion from where they dispersed around".

Is there an Albanian text that confirms what Meletius wrote in 1728? Yes there is; it is the "Cronicle of John Musachi". If you read the text of that chronicle carefully, you will find the same legend there. The time frame there is correct, also the place names and only the people's names are somewhat different from the actual ones. And another thing; if the Albanians are actually the descendants of the ancient Illyrians how come that John Musachi did not mention this in his chronicle? The answer is simple; John Musachi did not know anything about the alleged Illyrian ancestors; he did not consider Illyrians to be related with the modern Albanians. Only the books of Illyrian fairy tales says that. And another thing: the only error of Meletius is that he considered the Albanians to be of Celtic origin.

1. First, a text from 1332, people back then were not trained anthropologists or linguistics. Did this writer from 1332 actually visit every Albanian village and then described every ritual and rite? Albanians of today do not wear the same clothing. It varies greatly by region today just as it did then. The hat descriptions in the 1332 text are so vague, they could describe any hat. In any event, Slavs of different regions wear very different clothing. There is no one "Slav" hat just as there is no one "Albanian" hat. Slavs and Albanians wear varied hates from region to region. The Illyrians themselves were made of many different tribes. Ancient Illyria is a relatively large geographic area and it is more that everyone is this one large geographic area were all lumped as all "Illyrians" without regards to the complex linguistic and cultural differences all of these people actually had. The Slavs are the last major group to settle the Balkans. The Slavic Urheimat is around southern Poland/Ukraine. The Slavs of these varied regions speak related languages, but their clothing styles vary greatly. It is more probable the Slavs of the Balkans adapted to clothing styles which were already found there.
As well, we clearly have what Greeks wore in the Ancient and Byzantine eras and it is clearly not the Albanian costume which the Greeks claim today.

2. The Romans conquered many areas, but they did not settle them in large numbers necessarily. The Romans conquered Dacia, but they did not settle there in large numbers nor did Latin survive in Dacia. The Latin of Dacia comes from a later migration of Latin speakers from the West. The Romans conquered Britain and built a few buildings, but it was the Brythonic Celtic population that made up the bulk of the population. As well, Latin did not survive in Britain as would the low number of Roman settlers would demonstrate. Why did Latin not surive in Albania (southern Illyria)? Latin was not able to supplant Albanian which was the dominant language which was spoken by the vast majority of the population which was Albanian.

3. Albanians are indigenous to their areas which is demonstrated linguistically. Albanians did not come from the Caucasus. The people of the Caucasus Albania spoke Old Udi which is a Northeast Caucasian language close to Lezgian. Albanian dialects demonstrate that the Urheimat of Albanian would be around Kruja. This part of Albanian has the greatest linguistic diversity. If one looks at the dialects, one sees that the Gheg dialects all radiate out of Kruja area and then Gheg transitions into Tosk as one goes south. Likewise, Albanian shows clear relatively close links to Celtic, Italic, Germanic, Baltic, Slavic on one hand and Greek on another. Greek is closest to Phyrgian and Armenian linguistically. Albanians is also geographically between all of these groups which makes perfect sense.
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Re: Questions and Answers!!

#6

Post by Arta » Mon Nov 09, 2009 11:27 pm

Let's read more from HectorTheGreek.... -haha- Please some response to educate this ape will be appreciated!

That Franciscan monk that visited north Albania in 1322 was not a trained anthropologist nor a linguistics scientist, but he was not blind also. He narrated what he saw and that is what we analyse here. On your side you try to totally discredit him because what he wrote is inconvenient for the Albanian propaganda. On my side I read his and other people's texts and try to explain their contents. I understand that discrediting other people's texts works well in the Albanian "coffee-shops" and among the ignorant people that spent their time there, but in the real world, writings such as those of that Franciscan monk, are taken very seriously. So when he says that the Albanians looked like Greeks in dress and manners back in 1322 it is because this is what he saw. And you have not given any answer as to why did this happen.

The hat descriptions in the text of that Franciscan monk are not as "vague" as you like to describe them; in fact they are very clear. There is only one hat in the Balkans that is oblong and round and this is the "qeleshe", the "Slavic" hat that the modern Albanians wear with great pride as a national symbol. On the other hand, there is only one hat that is flat on the top and that is the Greek hat. And back in 1322 the Albanians were wearing the Greek hat and not the "qeleshe" as the modern Albanians would like us to believe. And of course the Albanians back in 1322 were wearing the "fustanella" same as the Greeks did in those times and that is what that Franciscan monk noticed, when he wrote that the Albanians dressed like Greeks. And of course he did not had to visit every village to notice this. You cannot mistake that dress easily.

The pattern of the Roman colonization in the Balkans is very familiar to many of us but you seem to ignore it. Historians like Theodor Mommsen and archaeologists like Arthur Evans and John Wilkes have done significant work on this subject. Greek and Roman people colonized the western Balkans along the eastern Adriatic coast and the inland in great numbers and left their traces there; the Dalmatian Latin language is a proof of this although it is not spoken anymore. You may choose to ignore it but this is the truth. In fact, the Romans extensively colonized the whole of Balkans and the Romanian language is proof of the lasting impact of that colonization.

All in all you failed to provide any answer to my questions. You see, the book of the Illyrian fairy tales may have all the answers for the imaginary fairy tales land but when its contents are compared with the truth contained in the old texts it fails completely to explain what happened back there. John Musachi did not know anything about Illyrians and neither did George Castriotis; they both lived in the real world, not in the one described in that book.
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Re: Questions and Answers!!

#7

Post by albanstatenisland » Mon Nov 09, 2009 11:40 pm

1.Greeks assimilated a large number of albanians, they have been doing so since antiquity,all europeans can look similar, thats absolute nonsense

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Re: Questions and Answers!!

#8

Post by jay_albania_fan » Tue Nov 10, 2009 3:38 am

Arta wrote:

The pattern of the Roman colonization in the Balkans is very familiar to many of us but you seem to ignore it. Historians like Theodor Mommsen and archaeologists like Arthur Evans and John Wilkes have done significant work on this subject. Greek and Roman people colonized the western Balkans along the eastern Adriatic coast and the inland in great numbers and left their traces there; the Dalmatian Latin language is a proof of this although it is not spoken anymore. You may choose to ignore it but this is the truth. In fact, the Romans extensively colonized the whole of Balkans and the Romanian language is proof of the lasting impact of that colonization.

If the Romans colonized the Balkans in large numbers as much as he claims, then Croatia, Serbia, Bosnia, and Albania should all be speaking a Romance language now. Yes, these areas were under Roman control, but not colonized in great numbers by Latin speakers. For example, in China the Han dynasty had control of Yunnan over 2,000 years ago but few Chinese ever settled in many of the areas of Yunnan. The Chinese avoided any areas with the Yi people.

Dalmatian Romance was all spoken on the coast and not the interior and it eventually gave way to Slavic languages. There is no native Romance language of Albania because Latin never was spoken there by any large numbers. The Romanian language in Dacia does not descend from the Romans who initially conquered Dacia. Romanian speakers did settle in Dacia later as the greatest Romanian linguistic diversity is outside Romania.
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Re: Questions and Answers!!

#9

Post by jay_albania_fan » Tue Nov 10, 2009 5:41 am

Also, consider the case of Egypt. It had been under foreign rule: Persian, Macedonian, Roman, Byzantine from the 300s BC to 630s AD and despite being controlled by these foreign powers the native language of most of the population remained the Ancient Egyptian language. The Ancient Egyptian language (later called Coptic) did not go extinct until the 1600s AD after nearly 1,000 years after the Islamic conquest in the 600s! So before one claims that since a powerful empire like Rome conquers a nation or area, that doesn't mean everyone there just started to speak Latin.
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Re: Questions and Answers!!

#10

Post by Arta » Thu Nov 12, 2009 9:19 pm

More stupidities from HectorBuas...LOL


I understand that you have absolutely no idea as to why the Albanians looked entirely like Greeks in dress and manners in 1322 and this is why you consistently avoid providing any answer about this issue. Also, you do not have any answer as to why the Albanians were wearing the Greek hat in those times while their descendants proudly wear the "Slavic" qeleshe nowadays; finally, you do not seem to have any idea about what kind of dress the Greeks and the Albanians were wearing back in those times. Yet you, like most of the Albanians here in YT, like to claim that the Greeks are somehow trying to steal the Albanian cultural heritage. But if we believe what is written in the old texts that heritage was always a Greek one, although, at the same time, it was not a foreign culture to the Albanians of those times.

Regarding the Roman presence in what was ancient Illyria, one can easily name more than 50 Greek and Roman cities along the eastern Adriatic coast (including the Albanian coast) and this indicates the strong presence of the Greco-Roman people in those lands. There was however one city which, by its sole existence, proves the strong presence of the Romans in the Balkan inland. This city is the ancient Sirmium, "the glorious mother of all cities" as one historian called it. It was once one of the four greatest cities of the Roman Empire and one of its provincial capitals. Many Roman emperors and other important Roman people were born there. Of course, the book of Illyrian fairy tales does not contain such information; in that book the Balkan inland was always inhabited by Illyrians hiding "somewhere in the mountains".

Did the "Latins" described in that text really existed or the person who wrote that text imagined or misunderstood what he saw? Was Scutari (Shkondra) a Latin city as that text tells us or was it always occupied by Albanians? What happened to those Latins? Where do their descendants live now? How are the families of Vryonioi/Vryennioi, Boianoi/Bua, Vraneoi and others connected to those Latins? Do you have any answers for any of these questions? I suspect you have no idea about any of these things. You see in the book of Illyrian fairy tales only the Ghegs that lived in northern Albania; in the real world things were a bit different. The Ghegs arrived at that place shortly AFTER that text was written and came there from Bosnia.
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Re: Questions and Answers!!

#11

Post by jay_albania_fan » Thu Nov 12, 2009 9:38 pm

Arta wrote:More stupidities from HectorBuas...LOL


I understand that you have absolutely no idea as to why the Albanians looked entirely like Greeks in dress and manners in 1322 and this is why you consistently avoid providing any answer about this issue. Also, you do not have any answer as to why the Albanians were wearing the Greek hat in those times while their descendants proudly wear the "Slavic" qeleshe nowadays; finally, you do not seem to have any idea about what kind of dress the Greeks and the Albanians were wearing back in those times. Yet you, like most of the Albanians here in YT, like to claim that the Greeks are somehow trying to steal the Albanian cultural heritage. But if we believe what is written in the old texts that heritage was always a Greek one, although, at the same time, it was not a foreign culture to the Albanians of those times.

Regarding the Roman presence in what was ancient Illyria, one can easily name more than 50 Greek and Roman cities along the eastern Adriatic coast (including the Albanian coast) and this indicates the strong presence of the Greco-Roman people in those lands. There was however one city which, by its sole existence, proves the strong presence of the Romans in the Balkan inland. This city is the ancient Sirmium, "the glorious mother of all cities" as one historian called it. It was once one of the four greatest cities of the Roman Empire and one of its provincial capitals. Many Roman emperors and other important Roman people were born there. Of course, the book of Illyrian fairy tales does not contain such information; in that book the Balkan inland was always inhabited by Illyrians hiding "somewhere in the mountains".

Did the "Latins" described in that text really existed or the person who wrote that text imagined or misunderstood what he saw? Was Scutari (Shkondra) a Latin city as that text tells us or was it always occupied by Albanians? What happened to those Latins? Where do their descendants live now? How are the families of Vryonioi/Vryennioi, Boianoi/Bua, Vraneoi and others connected to those Latins? Do you have any answers for any of these questions? I suspect you have no idea about any of these things. You see in the book of Illyrian fairy tales only the Ghegs that lived in northern Albania; in the real world things were a bit different. The Ghegs arrived at that place shortly AFTER that text was written and came there from Bosnia.
The qeleshe is not Slavic and the Albanians did not wear Greek clothing.

If there was a strong presence of Greeks and Romans all along the Adriatic coast then these areas should be Romance speaking today. The remnant Romance language of Dalmatian does show that Latin was spoken there, but not in any great numbers as Dalmatian went extinct. The large numbers of Romance speakers in France and Spain demonstrate that due to the long presence and large numbers of Latin speakers, the Latin language was pushed out by the Germanic Franks nor the Germanic Goths, in fact these conquerors who were smaller in number were not able to push Latin out. As well take Albania, the large number of Illyrian speaking native people (the Albanians) were not pushed out by Latin or Greek speakers. If they would have been, then Albanians would be speaking a Romance language (or Greek) today.

Just because a city has a Latin name, that does not mean the inhabitants were all Latin speaking. Does this make Alexandria Egypt only inhabited by Greek speakers? Does this make London only inhabited by Celtic speakers? Goths founded essentially all of the kingdoms of Iberia, so does this mean they are all Gothic speaking people in Iberia?

For Albania, it is clear is the autonomous language of the area. Also, it can be connected with what words remain in Illyrian such as Albanian mëz/mâz with Illyrian mandos. As well, Durrachion shows clearly an evolution into modern Albanian Durrës as well as Vlorë from Aulona. These sound changes attest to Albanian being spoken there a long time. Ulqin clearly demonstrates that Illyrian was Albanian. We don't fully understand how Illyrian, Dacian, and Thracian are related other than they are all Indo-European languages and are neighbors with each other. As well, we don't understand fully how complex the dialect situation was in Illyrian. Albanian is the southern form of what we call Illyrian.
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Re: Questions and Answers!!

#12

Post by Hymniarber » Thu Nov 12, 2009 11:41 pm

Arta wrote:More stupidities from HectorBuas...LOL


I understand that you have absolutely no idea as to why the Albanians looked entirely like Greeks in dress and manners in 1322 and this is why you consistently avoid providing any answer about this issue. Also, you do not have any answer as to why the Albanians were wearing the Greek hat in those times while their descendants proudly wear the "Slavic" qeleshe nowadays; finally, you do not seem to have any idea about what kind of dress the Greeks and the Albanians were wearing back in those times. Yet you, like most of the Albanians here in YT, like to claim that the Greeks are somehow trying to steal the Albanian cultural heritage. But if we believe what is written in the old texts that heritage was always a Greek one, although, at the same time, it was not a foreign culture to the Albanians of those times.

Regarding the Roman presence in what was ancient Illyria, one can easily name more than 50 Greek and Roman cities along the eastern Adriatic coast (including the Albanian coast) and this indicates the strong presence of the Greco-Roman people in those lands. There was however one city which, by its sole existence, proves the strong presence of the Romans in the Balkan inland. This city is the ancient Sirmium, "the glorious mother of all cities" as one historian called it. It was once one of the four greatest cities of the Roman Empire and one of its provincial capitals. Many Roman emperors and other important Roman people were born there. Of course, the book of Illyrian fairy tales does not contain such information; in that book the Balkan inland was always inhabited by Illyrians hiding "somewhere in the mountains".

Did the "Latins" described in that text really existed or the person who wrote that text imagined or misunderstood what he saw? Was Scutari (Shkondra) a Latin city as that text tells us or was it always occupied by Albanians? What happened to those Latins? Where do their descendants live now? How are the families of Vryonioi/Vryennioi, Boianoi/Bua, Vraneoi and others connected to those Latins? Do you have any answers for any of these questions? I suspect you have no idea about any of these things. You see in the book of Illyrian fairy tales only the Ghegs that lived in northern Albania; in the real world things were a bit different. The Ghegs arrived at that place shortly AFTER that text was written and came there from Bosnia.
Don't give him the pleasure to transmit his opinion without being a member in the forum. If he wants to participate, he is more than welcome, let's see what he would be capable to express himself in front of our opposition.
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Re: Questions and Answers!!

#13

Post by jay_albania_fan » Fri Nov 13, 2009 1:11 am

The problem with the logic is this according to him: Qeleshe are Slavic. Albanians wear qeleshe. Therefore, Albanians wear Slavic hats. The problem in his logic is that qeleshe are NOT Slavic. Therefore his whole argument makes no sense and is fallacious. The Slavic Urheimat is southern Poland/northwestern Ukraine and they don't wear qeleshe. The Slavs into the Balkans were the amongst the last groups to come in and more so it is really just the Slavic language which came not so much the Slavic culture as Poles, Bohemians, Ukrainians, Slovenes, and Bulgarians are not much alike except in language. Culturally, they are very different, different foods, different clothing, very different personalities, etc. Slavic areas outside the Slavic Urheimat had many different cultures there before. Bohemia had Celts, Bulgaria had Thracians as well as the Bulgars who came after the Slavs. The Bulgars were a Turkic people who founded Bulgaria. The Turkic element is quite heavy in Bulgaria and Romania. Turkic is not Turkish, btw. The Slavs who probably keep the most authentic Slavic culture are the Poles, Ruthenians, etc.

In any event, Albanian, Slav, Greek, German, etc are all Indo-European anyway.
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Re: Questions and Answers!!

#14

Post by LoneWolf » Wed Jul 29, 2015 2:45 pm

Is Prilepp a Muslim city? I found this online and many mosques showing in the background. I think is 19-th century though.

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#15

Post by Zeus10 » Wed Jul 29, 2015 3:20 pm

I really don't think this picture is taken on Prilep. This must be Bitola, or otherwise called Manastiri, a former Albanian city. Albanians were expelled from there, and forced to leave their country they found refuge in Turkey. Nowadays this city is inhabited principally by Slavic language speakers.
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