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erix77 wrote:per zeusin historia e njerezimit fillon vetem 1000 vjet me pare ndersa tani Shqiptaret na vijne nga portugalia,specialiteti i zeusit po behen teorite konspiracioniste...............jemi ne pritje te cudise te radhes!

Zeus10 wrote:Le te diskutojme per origjinen e popullit shqiptar. A jemi te mocem ne kete vend? A jemi te perjetshem aty, ne kuptimin relativ te fjales? A mos jemi nje shtresim mbi autoktonet? A kemi larguar dike prej andej? Apo jemi po aq te vjeter, sa gjithe kombet rreth nesh?
Opinioni im:
Ne jemi popullsite e ardhura nga PERENDIMI, ndoshta avangarda e atyre qe ne histori njihen si romake. Kjo avangarde perfshin popullsite qe dikur banonin rreth sot Portugalise, Spanjes edhe Frances qe njihen ne histori me emrin Albane dhe e vendosen qendren e tyre, atje ku sot eshte Roma. Albanet qe u vendosen ne Shqiperi zhvendosen ose treten popullsine vendase, qe ka qene semitike, ose dhe me e larget, duke u bere kombi dominant ne keto troje, per te pakten 1000 vjete. Gjuha e folur nga keta Albane u zevendesua ne Perendim nga gjuhet Romance te Perendimit, kurse ne Lindje nga gjuha Romake e Lindjes(greqishtja) dhe gjuhet e Ortodoksise Sllavike. Gjuha vernakulare e albaneve, ka filluar ne Portugali dhe ka mbaruar ne Lindjen e Mesme.

*In the 2nd century BC, the History of the World written by Polybius, mentions a location named Arbon[15] or Arbo[16] (Greek: Άρβωνα)[17] that was perhaps an island[18] in Liburnia or another location within Illyria. Stephanus of Byzantium centuries later, cites Polybius, saying it was a city in Illyria and gives an ethnic name (see below) for its inhabitants. Most likely it is a Croatian island of Rab.

*In the 2nd century AD, Ptolemy, the geographer and astronomer from Alexandria, drafted a map that shows the city of Albanopolis (located Northeast of Durrës). Ptolemy also mentions the Illyrian tribe named Albanoi,[19] who lived around this city.

*In the 6th century AD, Stephanus of Byzantium in his important geographical dictionary entitled Ethnica (Εθνικά)[20] mentions a city in Illyria called Arbon (Greek: Αρβών), with its inhabitants called Arbonios (Greek: Αρβώνιος) and Arbonites (Greek: Αρβωνίτης). He cites Polybius[20] (he does so many[21][22] times in ethnica) and does not claim that such city or people existed during his time.

Titus Livius or Livy [Chapters 11-20]

Preparations were made on both sides with the utmost vigour for a warvery like a civil one, in a manner between parents and children, both being of Trojan stock: for from Troy came Lavinium, from Lavinium, Alba, and the Romans were descended from the stock of the Alban kings.

Titus Livius or Livy [Chapters 22-25]

"Hear, O Jupiter; hear, O pater patratus of the Alban people, and ye...

Virgil, Aen. VII.v.219-220

..and Jupiter Latiaris, worshipped on the mountain Alban, did not represent the god of the third generation, the Hellenic Jove of the theomachy, who had usurped the throne of Saturn, but the great God of the Pelasgian nation, the divinity of light and atmospheric phenomena, to whom Saturn was assimilated, the historic representative of the tilling of the earth, of prosperity and abundance.
The most famous cult of the great Pelasgian God, as known by history to this day, was at Dodona in the Epirus...

The Aneid gives us an alternative, and possibly complementary meaning of the name Alban. The Trojans used to call themselves Albans while they were in Latium, giving the impression that their name had something in common with the giant called Albion who was killed by Hercules. It seems that Alban (Albion) must be a very ancient name.

He has the Alban name of Silvius, and he is your son, to be born after your passing; your queen Lavinia will rear him in the forests, and he will be a king and sire of kings, and founder of our dynasty which shall rule from Alba Longa. The nearest to him, there, is Procas, the pride of the Trojan race; and next Capys and Numitor, and Aeneas Silvius, who will revive your own name and be a prince exalted alike in his righteousness and his arms, if in fact he shall ever succeed to the Alban throne.

The Roman name for the Greek hero Heracles. The worship of Hercules at Rome and in Italy requires a separate consideration. His worship there is connected by late, especially Roman writers, with the hero's expedition to fetch the oxen of Geryones; and the principal points are, that Hercules in the West abolished human sacrifices among the Sabines, established the worship of fire, and slew Cacus, a robber, who had stolen eight of his oxen. (Dionys. i. 14; CACUS.) The aborigines, and especially Evander, honoured the hero with divine worship. (Serv. ad Aen. viii. 51, 269.) Hercules, in return, feasted the people, and presented the king with lands, requesting that sacrifices should be offered to him every year, according to Greek rites. Two distinguished families, the Potitii and Pinarii, were instructed in these Greek rites, and appointed hereditary managers of the festival. But Hercules made a distinction between these two families, which continued to exist for a long time after; for, as Pinarius arrived too late at the repast, the god punished him by declaring that lie and his descendants should be excluded for ever from the sacrificial feast. Thus the custom arose for the Pinarii to act the part of servants at the feast. (Diod. iv. 21; Dionys. i. 39, &c.; Liv. i. 40, v. 34; Nepos, Hann. 3; Plut. Quaest. Rom. 18; Ov. Fast. i. 581.) The Fabia gens traced its origin to Hercules, and Fauna and Acca Laurentia are called mistresses of Hercules. In this manner the Romans connected their earliest legends with Hercules. (Macrob. Sat. i. 10; August. de Civ. Dei, vi. 7.) It should be observed that in the Italian traditions the hero bore the name of Recaranus, and this Recaranus was afterwards identified with the Greek Heracles. He had two temples at Rome, one was a small round temple of Hercules Victor, or Hercules Triumphalis, between the river and the Circus Maximus, in the forum boarium, and contained a statue, which was dressed in the triumphal robes whenever a general celebrated a triumph. In front of this statue was the ara maxima, on which, after a triumph, the tenth of the booty was deposited for distribution among the citizens. (Liv. x. 23; Plin . H. N. xxxiv. 7, 16 ; Macrob. Sat. iii. 6; Tacit. Ann. xii. 24; Serv. ad Aen. xii. 24; Athen. v. 65; comp. Dionys. i. 40.) The second temple stood near the porta Trigemina, and contained a bronze statue and the altar on which Hercules himself was believed to have once offered a sacrifice. (Dionys. i. 39, 40; Plut. Quaest. Rom. 60; Plin. H. N. xxxiii. 12, 45.) Here the city praetor offered every year a young cow, which was consumed by the people within the sanctuary. The Roman Hercules was regarded as the giver of health (Lydus, de Mens. p. 92), and his priests were called by a Sabine name Cupenci. (Serv. ad Aen. xii. 539.) At Rome he was further connected with the Muses, whence he is called Musagetes, and was represented with a lyre, of which there is no trace in Greece. The identity of the Italian with the Greek Heracles is attested not only by the resemblance in the traditions and the mode of worship, but by the distinct belief of the Romans themselves. The Greek colonies had introduced his worship into Italy, and it was thence carried to Rome, into Gaul, Spain, arid even Germany. (Tac. Germ. 2.) But it is, nevertheless, in the highest degree probable that the Greek mythus was engrafted upon, or supplied the place of that about the Italian Recaranus or Garanus. [GARANUS.]

Laonikos Chalkokondyles (c. 1423–1490), the Byzantine historian, thought that the Albanians hailed from Italy. The theory has its origin in the first mention of Albanians, made by Attaliates (11th century): "... For when subsequent commanders made base and shameful plans and decisions, not only was the island lost to Byzantium, but also the greater part of the army. Unfortunately, the people who had once been our allies and who possessed the same rights as citizens and the same religion, i.e. the Albanians and the Latins, who live in the Italian regions of our Empire beyond Western Rome, quite suddenly became enemies when Michael Dokenianos insanely directed his command against their leaders..."[98]

Se fundmi, une nuk mendoj se nje dyshim i skajshem i gjithe literatures greko-romake eshte i perligjur. Une kam prirje t'i besoj autenticitetit te tyre per aq kohe sa ato jane te mbeshtetura ne menyre solide nga arkeologjia dhe diciplina te tjera shkencore.

Procopius-The Gothic War, Book V, 80: For among the Bruttii are the Epizephyrian Locrians and the inhabitants of Croton and Thurii. But north of the gulf the first inhabitants are Greeks, called Epirotes, as far as the city of Epidamnus, which is situated on the sea. And adjoining this is the land of Precalis, beyond which is the territory called Dalmatia, all of which is counted as part of the western empire. And beyond that point is Liburnia,[81] and Istria, and the land of the Veneti extending to the city of Ravenna. These countries are situated on the sea in that region. But above them are the Siscii and Suevi (not those who are subjects of the Franks, but another group), who inhabit the interior. And beyond these are settled the Carnii and Norici. On the right of these dwell the Dacians and Pannonians, who hold a number of towns, including Singidunum[82] and Sirmium, and extend as far as the Ister River. Now these peoples north of the Ionian Gulf were ruled by the Goths at the beginning of this war, but beyond the city of Ravenna on the left of the river Po the country was inhabited by the Ligurians.[83] And to the north of them live the Albani in an exceedingly good land called Langovilla, and beyond these are the nations subject to the Franks, while the country to the west is held by the Gauls and after them the Spaniards. On the right of the Po are Aemilia[84] and the Tuscan peoples, which extend as far as the boundaries of Rome. So much, then, for this.”