"Moreover, you scorned our people, and compared the Albanese to sheep, and according to your custom think of us with insults. Nor have you shown yourself to have any knowledge of my race. Our elders were Epirotes, where this Pirro came from, whose force could scarcely support the Romans. This Pirro, who Taranto and many other places of Italy held back with armies. I do not have to speak for the Epiroti. They are very much stronger men than your Tarantini, a species of wet men who are born only to fish. If you want to say that Albania is part of Macedonia I would concede that a lot more of our ancestors were nobles who went as far as India under Alexander the Great and defeated all those peoples with incredible difficulty. From those men come these who you called sheep. But the nature of things is not changed. Why do your men run away in the faces of sheep?"
Letter from Skanderbeg to the Prince of Taranto ▬ Skanderbeg, October 31 1460

THE ALBANIAN STËR- PREFIX

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Orakulli
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THE ALBANIAN STËR- PREFIX

#1

Post by Orakulli » Thu Sep 01, 2011 3:33 am

THE ALBANIAN STËR- PREFIX

Friday, December 16, 2011
How humans made the words.

How humans have made the words? How they created father, grandfather, great grandfather meanings?.

We have in Albanian and English these forms:

1. *at 'father'
2. *gjysh 'grandfather'
3. *stërgjysh 'great grandfather'

The basic meaning of #1: the root is: at 'father'. In all European languages the “at” is the unattached particle. Only in Albanian it is a really word, not a particle. It is so clear the first part of the word father is from Albanian *at ‘father. In the geg Tirana dialect it is also *tate. Ancient Greek átta ‘daddy’, etc.);

Albanian words for father and grandfather has two basic roots that have the capability of standing alone. The English word grandfather has the added suffix-grand: having higher rank than others of the same category. It is very clear that the word “grandfather” is created after the word “father”, through suffix grand , adding a new signification to the basic meaning of the first term father. It very clear they are not formed at the same time, even though the father and grandfather exist at the same time for the son or the nephew, and this addition-adjective comes from Latin *Grandis 'big, great', which became a size-age quantifier for the English word 'grandfather' . It is not a original one, but got a new meaning performance in this case. A granfather is bigger than a father in the sense of "length of time that each one has existed".
So, Albanian for "grandfather" has not in use an “add signification” word, an adjective-suffix, but an original native word: gjysh. English and most languages use the grammar possessive forms adding to a noun an adjective in this case.

1.At>ater>fater>father >grand+father=great+ grandfather, great=grand, grandxgrandxfather
2.Giys>gjysh
3. Sipër+tër+gjysh=Stërgjysh

Later:

The addition #1; prefix: F, V, P
The addition #2; sufix: Her, er, re

Adding signification to a word by a prefix is more complicated.

Albanian has a very interesting prefix stër- as well: semantic enlargement or excess: ultra-, super-, over for

1: stër-gjatë 'too tall', stër-bujar 'too generous', stër-zgjat "too long";

2: stërgjysh/'great-grandfather', stër-gjyshe 'great-grandmother', stër-nip ‘greatgrandson;
great-nephew’, stër-mbes ‘great-granddaughter’.
3. There is also a use with verbs, as in stër-holloj ‘go into excessive detail’ (cf.holloj ‘make too thin; clarify; explain in detail’), stër-nxeh ‘overheat; make extremely hot’ (cf. nxeh ‘heat, make something hot’), stër-mundoj 'overstrain;to force beyond a natural or proper limit.

Is it just a semantic extension of Latin 'extra , or a parallel developments, or is there something else?

The Latin form: preposition + Noun type (pro-auos).
The Greek form:. ék-pappos ‘great-great-grandfather’

• epí-pappos ‘grandfather, great-grandfather, great-great-grandfather’.

Is the form *epí related with Albanian verb *hip 'climb, go up'?

Other forms:

• Lat. ab-avus ‘great-great-grandfather’
• ad-nepos ‘great-great-great-grandson’
• Sanskrit: prati-naptṛ- 'great-grandson'
para-prati-naptṛ- 'great-great-grandson' .
We can see here the prefix *para, which is known as = ‘distant, remote’, but it exists in Albanian too, and it is very interesting; the "‘para" means “before”. For example, I am making a new Albanian word *para-gjyshi, which would be 'before-grandfather', which is close to the semantic meaning than Sanskrit. The "para" means not only earlier than the particular time, but also is equivalent with the meaning of English forebear, at a time in the past. The Sanskrit para-prati-naptṛ has the meaning of "after-before-son", in which the logical word order is: A great great grandson is a son born after a grandson. (1.before-para, 2.after-prati.)
The new signification of the new compound word I made the *para-gjyshi is based to the time , when the two language elements take place. I made an experiment with my language, However I doubt that someone has made it really in Russian. The Russian word for great grandfather is "praded ", and for grandfather is "ded ", with the only exception that the Russian word for before is "do". I'm not so sure about that. Maybe it happened during the period where these meanings coalesced.
Where *stër is coming from?

Maybe it comes from others form of Albanian involving emphasis. Which one could be?
My etymological suggestion for the generational function of ‘stër-:

1. Albanian shows a word *sipër with the meaning of “above”, “ on top of” . So it is someone “above grandfather”. Albanian having the word *hip for climb brings the conclusion that the *sipër comes from the "sip" which is the root and the "ër", which in this case is a kind of suffix.
2. Albanian shows another word *tër- that means “ over “/ “excessive”.Seen in *tër-heq 'pull', *tër-boj 'infuriate', *tër-kuzë with the idiomatic meaning “too long”, because the specific meaning of /tër/ is all.


The phonetic transformation rule: sip+tër>siptër>stër

The meaning for *stër- makes sense only understanding the relation between the specific sense of *sipër and the quantifier sense of *tër-, that when the forms were connected to ‘gjysh', it carried along both functions: Sipër+tër+gjysh= stërgjysh 'Above all fathers', which leads to the concept 'great grandfather'.
In this case the new signification of the new compound word is based to the time-position of one element to the whole of the group amount, where all elements are identical, fathers. The language elements "fathers" are considered mathematically equally like numbers by the unknown creator.


References:
I.Albanian dictionary:
Stër- fjalëform.
Parashtesë me të cilën ndërtohen fjalë të
prejardhura:
a) që tregojnë se diçka bëhet me tepri, ka madhësi
a përmasa të jashtëzakonshme pse është jashtë
asaj që duhet; p.sh. i stërgjatë, stërholloj, i
stërlashtë, stërlodhem, i stërmadh, stërmundim, i
stërplakur etj.;
b) që shënojnë lidhje familjare me largësi përtej tre
brezave; p.sh. stërgjysh, stërnip etj.

Sipër
I. ndajf.
1. Në një vend më të lartë në krahasim me një
tjetër; në pjesën e lartë të diçkaje; lart; në katin a
në katet më lart të një ndërtese, lart.

II."The Etymology of the Albanian stër prefix"; Brian D. Joseph; The Ohio State University.
(http://lucian.uchicago.edu/blogs/alblin ... tation.pdf)

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Posted by Fatmir Iliazi at 6:40 PM
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Schroeder84
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Re: THE ALBANIAN STËR- PREFIX

#2

Post by Schroeder84 » Thu Sep 06, 2012 2:46 pm

thank you for explaining that!
explanations from the copybooks are not always clear.

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Re: THE ALBANIAN STËR- PREFIX

#3

Post by Orakulli » Thu Feb 28, 2013 4:20 am

Shroeder ,

If you want to be more informed about what is not copybooks , and copies of copies of the same thing about languages and linguistics, you can read:

http://linguisticglob.blogspot.com/2011 ... words.html

Especially, these paragraphs:

We can see here the prefix *para, which is known as = ‘distant, remote’, but it exists in Albanian too, and it is very interesting; the "‘para" means “before”. For example, I am making a new Albanian word *para-gjyshi, which would be 'before-grandfather', which is close to the semantic meaning than Sanskrit. The "para" means not only earlier than the particular time, but also is equivalent with the meaning of English forebear, at a time in the past. The Sanskrit para-prati-naptṛ has the meaning of "after-before-son", in which the logical word order is: A great great grandson is a son born after a grandson. (1.before-para, 2.after-prati.)
The new signification of the new compound word I made the *para-gjyshi is based to the time , when the two language elements take place. I made an experiment with my language, However I doubt that someone has made it really in Russian. The Russian word for great grandfather is "praded ", and for grandfather is "ded ", with the only exception that the Russian word for before is "do". I'm not so sure about that. Maybe it happened during the period where these meanings coalesced.
Albanian words for father and grandfather has two basic roots that have the capability of standing alone. The English word grandfather has the added suffix-grand: having higher rank than others of the same category. It is very clear that the word “grandfather” is created after the word “father”, through suffix grand , adding a new signification to the basic meaning of the first term father. It very clear they are not formed at the same time, even though the father and grandfather exist at the same time for the son or the nephew, and this addition-adjective comes from Latin *Grandis 'big, great', which became a size-age quantifier for the English word 'grandfather' . It is not a original one, but got a new meaning performance in this case. A granfather is bigger than a father in the sense of "length of time that each one has existed".
So, Albanian for "grandfather" has not in use an “add signification” word, an adjective-suffix, but an original native word: gjysh. English and most languages use the grammar possessive forms adding to a noun an adjective in this case.

1.At>ater>fater>father >grand+father=great+ grandfather, great=grand, grandxgrandxfather
2.Giys>gjysh
3. Sipër+tër+gjysh=Stërgjysh
1. Albanian shows a word *sipër with the meaning of “above”, “ on top of” . So it is someone “above grandfather”. Albanian having the word *hip for climb brings the conclusion that the *sipër comes from the "sip" which is the root and the "ër", which in this case is a kind of suffix.
2. Albanian shows another word *tër- that means “ over “/ “excessive”.Seen in *tër-heq 'pull', *tër-boj 'infuriate', *tër-kuzë with the idiomatic meaning “too long”, because the specific meaning of /tër/ is all.


The phonetic transformation rule: sip+tër>siptër>stër

The meaning for *stër- makes sense only understanding the relation between the specific sense of *sipër and the quantifier sense of *tër-, that when the forms were connected to ‘gjysh', it carried along both functions: Sipër+tër+gjysh= stërgjysh 'Above all fathers', which leads to the concept 'great grandfather'.
In this case the new signification of the new compound word is based to the time-position of one element to the whole of the group amount, where all elements are identical, fathers. The language elements "fathers" are considered mathematically equally like numbers by the unknown creator.

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